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I took out the Amex Platinum on 12 Oct and have almost hit the 75k points spend target due to some business travel.
We’ve used the Harvey Nicks credit and plan to use the dining credit before new year. Will do the same again with next year’s credits in Jan before cancelling.
I’m thinking the refund will be in the order of £430.
Given we have young kids so don’t get much chance to use the travel benefits, and that I do most of my spend on the BA Amex for the 241 voucher… Is it ever worth keeping the Platinum Amex?
I’m thinking they’d have to offer at least 50k Avios with a minimal spend target to justify the remaining fee.
Is there anything I’m missing?
You have hit the nail on the head! The very fact that Amex needs to offer huge retentions to persuade people to keep the card says it all. If it offered value to the average punter, they could call their bluff and say fine to cancel if you wish without any meaningful loss of customers. As it is, they have turned retention bonuses into the greatest (albeit unpublished) benefit of the card and people have come to feel entitled to them.
You are more likely to get 35k rather than 50k at this stage but it will probably have no condition or spend target attached so you cancel anyway, further highlighting the absurdity of the process.
If they offer 35k retention, when does it post? Would need to cancel before the Feb deadline to get the pro rata refund before they cease
If they offer 35k retention, when does it post? Would need to cancel before the Feb deadline to get the pro rata refund before they cease
Within a day or two typically.
If they offer 35k retention, when does it post? Would need to cancel before the Feb deadline to get the pro rata refund before they cease
Within a day or two typically.
Thanks! Even better… how absurd 🤯
I don’t think it’s all about card value but also maintaining the tiny market share that Amex actually have in the UK, because you will normally also receive 10,000 to 20,000 retention MR points if you threaten to cancel the PRG card. A card that I feel does offer better value to the average punter.
I don’t think it’s all about card value but also maintaining the tiny market share that Amex actually have in the UK, because you will normally also receive 10,000 to 20,000 retention MR points if you threaten to cancel the PRG card. A card that I feel does offer better value to the average punter.
The PRG is a great value card, but for quite a small audience. If you don’t mind paying (or your firm pays) FX fees, often for s75 and spend a lot on non BA airlines it really works.
I think one of the clues on retentions is they offer the lowest ones on BAPP most probably as it’s their only card with a USP. In relation to the card fee, 10k Avios is quite little vs that offered on the other two.
For Platinum, Amex needs to get on with confirming that the dining benefits and HN will extend beyond 2024. And whether it stays at the current levels, the value of which has been reduced by inflation at a time the card fee has risen.
Closing the pro – rata refund / £400 of Cashback per calendar year loophole seems just as warranted as clamping down in retention bonuses.
I still see long term value in holding onto the card but the it becomes more difficult to rationalise with each price hike.
I think @JDB hits the nail on the head here – the Plat card just doesn’t have a USP that sufficiently justifies the (high) price, for most people. If loyalty enthusiasts like HfPers don’t see value then how must ordinary peeps feel about the prospect of paying £650 a year for the privilege of waving this piece of metal around? It must be a relatively low number of people who subscribe and then retain the card longterm, which cannot be what Amex want, but until the offering is significantly revised it will continue to be a niche card. I can justify holding the Business Plat, but that is mainly because the tax deductibility of the annual card fee (and the wider benefits not coming from income that has been taxed) takes it (just) into value for money territory for me…
I think when you look at the benefits in the UK and markets like USA (I know it’s a bit like comparing oranges and apples given the immense competition and transaction fees over there) but it’s not hard to see why Amex doesn’t struggle retaining customers as much. $200 Uber, Hotel, Travel credit, $155 Walmart Credit, not to mention Clear+ and Equinox as well as Digital Credit. Most of the benefits even an average frequent traveller would benefit from and/or find ways to utilise in day to day life.
Indeed – the platinum is marginal at best. Mrs Froggee is very attached to hers for reasons that I can’t quite understand but happy wife, happy life.
The best thing you can do is write down the list of benefits that you use and then put a price on them. I would struggle to get to £650 personally but it is close enough that I don’t feel compelled to bully Mrs Froggee into cancelling.
I reckon she is something like:
– Harvey Nicks 2x£50 = £70
– UK restaurant credit = £120
– Foreign restaurant credit = £50 (not easy to use)
– hotel statuses for us both – £50
– priority pass – £100 (it’s nice to have but we concluded it’s worth around £25 a visit for four of us!)
– Amex offers ???So that’s £390 + the intangible benefit of Mrs Froggee having a shiny card + the unquantifiable Amex offers (this is unquantifiable as Mrs Froggee’s personal spending is a state secret and I actually respect that but she says she has had some good savings – my concern is that some of these savings are on “jewellery” tat that she wouldn’t have bought otherwise) plus the occasional other random thing of note that is occasionally of interest such as FHR (used once), events (used once).
Given that I got offered the 100,000 upgrade from gold I thought the smart thing to do would be for me to take platinum for 2-3 years while she had a rest but our earned income is now derisory so there is no guarantee we could replicate our current card portfolio so I didn’t push the point.
In conclusion it’s very personal but assuming you have steady income etc, the rationale thing to do is to churn your card portfolio and play the game. I don’t do this but I 100% understand why people do. Unlike @JDB I don’t overly grudge people their sign-up and retention offers as I’ve played the game in the past enough not to be a hypocrite!
@Froggee – Your post is a great guide as to how we should all be weighing up personal value in these decisions, rather than mindlessly following the herd. Happy wife* happy life is also a great tenet (*other types of spouse are available, but don’t rhyme as well!).
I’m in a similar position, but rather whether to take the upgrade option from Gold or not.
My Gold renewal is due at the end of this month, so would definitely do it around then to take advantage of this year’s credits, before they re-set on 1st Jan.
I would only take the card for 1 year, so certainly wouldn’t renew for the additional 25k MR.
So it’s £650 for 75k MR, but with the below credits, which I believe are correct, assuming I take the card before the new year, and how I value them:
– HN 3x £50 = £120 value
– UK dining 2x £150 = £140 (I am unlikely to have dined at any of the restaurants without the credit, and would usually pay around £70 for dinner at another restaurant I was paying for, as we don’t drink).
– Global dining 2x £150 = £0-50 as highly unlikely to use
– Hotel status = £100-£150 (the only status worthwhile is Hilton Gold for the breakfast, and to unlock 5-4-4)
– PP – £50 max – have used the 3x free passes on Gold but haven’t needed more as travelling in J on other occasions, but might change next year, plus option to try Centurion lounge.Losing:
– Deliveroo credit = £40 value as not used every month.
– Rewards as you go = 12.5k MR = £125
– Gold earning on airlines and Amex travel = approx 3k MR extra earned = £30So that makes £650 for 75k MR, with max £510 value from Plat, but with a loss of £195 value from the Gold = £335 net.
With all that, I think I can probably justify plat for 1 year, but not to renew for the additional 25k MR!
@Froggee’s model is a good one and I see it as:
– Harvey Nicks 2x£50 = £90 (I have to pay postage but turns out there is stuff I would otherwise buy)
– UK restaurant credit = £150 (Restaurant list matches my preferences)
– Foreign restaurant credit = £0 (Can’t see a single match I care about)
– Hotel status = $0 (Not the kind of hotels we choose and a free Hilton breakfast is a free bad breakfast)
– Travel Insurance = £85 (costs for my wife if I take my employer’s free cover)
– Priority pass = 0 (We have BA status or fly business class)So the maths for me is whether Platinum or even Gold is valuable on top of the BAPP that I always have for the annual 2-4-1 voucher. Given the standard earn rate is higher on the BAPP for stuff I buy day-to-day, the answer for me is I will forego the remaining part of the 100k SUB when I reach my target and just cancel.
I can’t see the benefit of Gold or Plat for me on top of the BAPP that I won’t give up.
As there are 3 of us in the family, usually travelling long-haul in PE, I find it easy to make it work.
This year, we have had HN x 2, GBP150 UK dining, 120 abroad, around 20 airport lounge entrances and around
60 Hilton breakfasts! Quite apart from sign-up bonuses, etc.And it’s so pretty!
Happy wife* happy life is also a great tenet (*other types of spouse are available, but don’t rhyme as well!).
I go with Happy spouse = Happy house 🙂
As for the Platinum card I came to the conclusion that none of the benefits listed work for me so it comes down to do I want to pay the annual fee? It was too much even before they increased it to the current level so to paraphrase Dragons Den “I’m out”
I am happy with the BAPP so stick with that.
@Froggee I too subscribe to the happy wife maxim and you are clearly very generous. I wonder how many wives, in tougher economic times, will tell their husbands to get a grip when they try to justify spending £650/year on this card for the privilege of waving it around. (I’m sure that some are rather disappointed that Apple Pay etc. has slightly put paid to the potential for platinum willy waving).
I don’t really grudge people getting retentions, my issue that it is very unfair on the majority of cardholders who don’t know, yet have to pay for them. It’s great that the HfP community has reported receiving over 10,000,000 MR in retentions over the last 15 months or so but I would much rather Amex woke up and addressed the underlying problem – i.e. design a product that people will renew each year without having to be bribed. They might even then be able to sign up rather more punters than they have today. Spraying a whole lot of expensive air freshener (points) does not alleviate a chronic smell (sh1t product).
Unlike say insurance or mobile contracts, credit cards have a single fixed price, so secret discounts offered to a few feels very wrong in the context of the overall framework of UK financial regulation. I suspect that they won’t be able to continue paying retentions here in the way they currently do for that much longer. The other thing that seems odd with retentions is how do you explain on the one hand that your product offers good value under the new FCA rules, yet on the other hand you have to pay inducements to people equivalent to the annual fee or more to take/keep the card. But somehow, they have to keep the plates spinning, so they can report positive customer acquisitions and retentions, whatever the cost.
Now they are in a vicious circle, every increasing customer/costs acquisition costs, so what do you do? Put the price up to make it less painful for Amex but a worse proportion for the (potential) cardholder. Seems smart.
Amex UK seems stuck in group think and slavishly follows the US model, in a potentially lucrative (albeit nothing like as lucrative as the US) but very different UK market, the Platinum product is very tired, poorly targeted and increasingly less relevant. Nimbler operators will surely move into the over £250 card market with more contemporary offerings; Revolut is trying and even the sleepy old legacy banks are getting in on the act.
– hotel statuses for us both – £50
Do you not stay at Hilton and use the free breakfast? It’s a decent perk.
Losing:
– Deliveroo credit = £40 value as not used every month.If you upgrade you’ll still get the credits. Offers from gold, if saved, are carried over.
Losing:
– Deliveroo credit = £40 value as not used every month.If you upgrade you’ll still get the credits. Offers from gold, if saved, are carried over.
They eventually disappear, so make sure you check the offer is still there before you place any orders.
Losing:
– Deliveroo credit = £40 value as not used every month.If you upgrade you’ll still get the credits. Offers from gold, if saved, are carried over.
Thanks for letting me know, that would be useful, if it does carry over.
@JDB there may be a slight difference in our marriages! Mrs Froggee had her own career and earned her own money and we have maintained separate finances. Admittedly I seem to pay for most things while she squirrels her money away but this is arguably fair as she retired in her 30s to focus on the boys whereas I kept going well into my 40s. Basically it isn’t my place to tell her what she can and can’t spend her money on. She listens with interest and then does whatever she wants anyway! We have established that I make family decisions (with consultation) but she has power of veto. And my money is our money, but her money is her money, it seems to work for us.
@BBbetter we do indeed sometimes stay in Hilton hotels but try not to let the tail wag the dog. So in 2023, Mrs Froggee had two nights (with her cousin) so four breakfasts and I have had two nights on my own.Of these nights, three were redemptions and one was using the 9,000 MR Amex credit. Six middling Hilton breakfasts when other options were available? £50 says I. In the past we’ve had much longer stays in e.g. Hilton Garden Inns in the States and indeed Conrads as a couple but Hiltons have been less appealing of late given where we’ve been.
@aq.1988 – the Deliveroo offer doesn’t carry across to a Platinum upgrade. That sort of offer which is an advertised benefit is tied to the card type. Only the ‘random’ offers will be put on the new card.
@aq.1988 – the Deliveroo offer doesn’t carry across to a Platinum upgrade. That sort of offer which is an advertised benefit is tied to the card type. Only the ‘random’ offers will be put on the new card.
I’ve read someone else say the same thing (that the credits continue), but I suspect that it may be a bug not a feature!
@Froggee actually it’s similar in our household but my wife resumed her very successful career after child rearing thanks to grandfathered rights that no longer exist, so she has now even significantly re-squirrelled.
She is scarily clever though (I’m apparently “of good average intelligence”) so she even has me paying for her Platinum card although as I have mentioned before it’s for offspring benefit more than hers. I haven’t even had a crumb from her UK dining credit, but may get a morsel of the foreign one next month!
She is also much more hawkish about the scourge of retentions than I am.
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