S Africa/Alternatives in November/December (young family)

[Annie]

I would perhaps re think a game reserve with a baby. I’ve stayed in a few and I can’t see how a baby would work on game drives. It’s a rough ride and I doubt a car seat would be practical in those jeeps.
I’m out the other side and a grandma now and I would echo the advice of others and keep it super simple especially for the first trip.

Whether the risk is real or perceived is not the issue, you are already concerned about it so perhaps choose something easier on you all.

[Mike G]

We’re doing a very similar trip in February with our first child who will be 6 months old. We booked it pre baby with a 2-4-1 knowing that we could always cancel if the baby was difficult. Thankfully he’s tuned out to be really chilled so we’re going ahead with it. We had a small European holiday in October, to test the waters so to speak and he was fine. We’ve never been to SA before but if you take sensible precautions then I’m sure it will be fine. I’d personally stick with your original plans. I’ve heard a lot that it gets much harder to travel when they’re toddlers so make the most of it while you can!

[qc]

I don’t agree with those who say it’s too stressful and don’t do it etc.

Bring the Calpol and all other medications you may need with you. Bring his favourite prepared foods and snacks.

We did a 3 month round the world trip with our then 15-18 month old – he’s nearly 40 now. The worst problem we found was that disposable nappies even in Australia and NZ were not as the Pampers we were used to here. He was no longer eating baby food but he was a fussy eater (he has made up for it since) so that was the most challenging thing we found. He in turn took his just 1 year old to Bali.

If you want to see some game you can self drive in Addo Elephant Park – we stayed at River Bend Lodge which was very nice but we saw more game on the day we drove around ourselves.

In Hermanus we stayed in an apartment owned by Harbour House hotel – Harbour Square. You still get breakfast at the hotel and can use the pool there. It would be very convenient to stay there with a baby.

One tip on travelling with a baby that you could bear in mind for future trips is that if the child is under 2 on the outbound but has their birthday whilst on holiday BA allocates a seat to the child for the return and it doesn’t cost any more in Avios/cash. We used 2 x 2-4-1s to take our son and his baby in F – it was great seeing my granddaughter in her own seat on the A380 watching Frozen with her little pink headphones.

[BBbetter]

strickers wrote:

don’t underestimate how much ‘stuff’ you’ll need

We thought the same, but with globalisation, you kind of find out that same or similar products are available in places you visit. Nappies, wipes, toys, books etc. With a bit of research, you can reduce the amount of stuff you need to take and buy things at the destination, unless its a forest or desert.

[Cal]

To follow up with more details of the game reserves we visited, I did quite a lot of research to see which ones accepted small children. We ended up going to Garden Route Game Lodge for 1 night which is just off the N2 near Mossel Bay and allows kids of all ages on the game drives. One family there took their 9 month old baby in a front carrier on the vehicle along with their toddler and seemed to get on ok. This is not very ‘wild'(they seem to know roughly where the animals are rather than having to look very hard for them!) but not as commercial as I was expecting and we actually had a great time, all run very smoothly. They sat all the families with kids at one end of the dining room (which was good for people there without kids!) and they all played together. They also have a very warm family pool with toddler pool attached which he loved. We also went to Hartenbos Private Game Reserve, which is smaller and family run. They were fine with our 2.5 year old on the drive but you’d have to ask about a babies I think. We stopped for lunch and a swim at Botlierskop which is another one near Mossel Bay, but they didn’t allow small kids on game drives. I know Gondwana doesn’t allow babies and older small kids can go if you pay for a private vehicle for just your family. If you’re near Port Elizabeth you could do a self-drive in Addo Elephant National Park, which we have done previously. You will mainly see elephants, zebra etc but still a fun experience as it’s a bit more ‘wild’ and we did it in a normal sedan car as most of the roads are tarmac or good gravel.

I went whale watching in Hermanus on my own as hubby had seen them before, and I’m glad I didn’t try to take the little one. I saw someone on another boat with a baby but not sure I’d recommend it as quite a few people on my boat were sea sick. We saw 2 whales – it was the last week in November and they said it was hit or miss whether we would see them so I was pleased we did!

[Tracey]

I don’t see how you can do a game drive with a baby in tow. For a random suggestion, I would do Capetown and then go to Zambia, see Victoria Falls. If you stay in the royal Livingston hotel you have giraffes wondering around the grounds.

[heinztein]

The great thing about SA is the lack of jetlag so highly recommend sticking with that if you can.

As a dad of 2 under 2 who loves travelling there is honestly a lot to be said for the all inclusive resorts that are geared up for young children

Here is some stuff I didn’t think about before kids arrived:
– what are you going to do each night between 7pm and 7am when baby sleeps? Boring being stuck in your accommodation.
– Baby may not be a good sleeper which impacts on you the next day
– do you want any of the holiday to be about baby’s enjoyment – e.g. swimming, soft play, sensory activities?
– how much extra luggage and equipment must you carry and how will that impact plans? (Toys, several outfits per day for the wee one, breast pump potentially, sterilisation gear, car seat)
– entertaining a 10 month old all day is hard work!

[qc]

To address what to do when the baby is sleeping book accommodation with a balcony so that you can sit outside with a glass of wine after they’ve gone to bed.

[JDB]

@NorthernLass – big question is, was it easier then than it is now? Personally, I think it was much easier when one simply had to use common sense and understand one’s own child’s character and needs. I think I (and my wife) would find the extraordinary volume of advice enough to drive one round the twist. It also had the advantage of travelling with really very little extra kit and probably a much too unfancy push chair but it all worked out just fine. I’m afraid we also never went to child oriented hotels, there’s more than enough to keep them busy and happy everywhere without being in a zoo.

[Mouse]

Cape Town is perfectly safe with sensible precautions – Joburg and Rio are a world apart.

[nbaguette]

I grew up in South Africa and my parents still live there, so I have travelled there multiple times with my daughter who is now 2.5 years old. She was 4 months old the first time we travelled with her (and then got stuck there due to Omicron!) and have been about 6 times since. I would say it is a relatively easy flight with a baby, because it is overnight and the time difference is only 1hr or 2hr depending on time of year. I have even done it 3 times on my own with my daughter (without my husband) and that involves doing a connection in Johannesburg as my parents live in Durban and there are no direct flights. I found 10 months was a pretty good time to travel as they are (likely) not yet mobile and will hopefully still fit in the bassinet. Worst was when my daughter was about 20 months and she was really too big to be on my lap and didn’t understand why she needed to stay sitting down with her seat belt on – she just wanted to run around on the plane! A direct flight to Cape Town with two of you and a 10 month old will be absolutely fine. We are flying to NYC with her next month and I am actually dreading that much more due to the time difference.

In terms of safety, as the previous person says, I think it is safe with sensible precautions. E.g. no flashy jewellery/watches, don’t wander around at night and take advice on where is safe to go from the hotel/guest house where you are staying. A lot of the time when tourists run into trouble it is because they have gone somewhere/done something that the locals would never do.

If you are planning to drive the Garden Route, it is worth taking your own car seat if you can as I’m not sure how good the hired car seats are. Also hope your child is a good sleeper in the car (my daughter was) and then they will likely sleep a lot of the way which will make the driving much less stressful.

Overall, it is not without risk (but nowhere is!) but you can still have a great time there, just need to be a bit careful and aware of your surroundings. Generally, South Africa is also a child-friendly place in that most places and people are very accommodating of children (more so than the UK in my experience).

[nbaguette]

I should add that private healthcare is world-class and very cheap to just pay for when you have GBP. You should have no trouble getting medicines and nappies etc in pharmacies, but I did find the nappy sizing was different to UK, so just check the weight ranges when buying. I would, however, not rely on any government healthcare. Hopefully it won’t be needed, but make sure you have good travel insurance in place just in case (but this is true for any destination).

[squawk7700]

Some polarising views on this thread and I welcome all of them, so thank you for spelling out the good, the bad, and the ugly!

I don’t entirely understand “I think you are mad” type views but am prepared to eat my words in 10 months time. By chance I met a colleague yesterday who had taken his 2 infants to Machu Picchu recently and had a brilliant time. I guess a lot of it depends on the baby, and how much we’re willing to sacrifice e.g. getting to bed early most nights (which kind of suits well with the security situation…).

We’ve got a simple All Inclusive trip to Majorca planned in the summer to learn the ropes a little re travelling with babies and I think based on the (majority) of replies here that we’ll stick to South Africa for the timebeing. We’ve got Avios and vouchers with expiry dates and so whilst baby is going to take over our World, we want to give it our best shot before we have to start paying for them >2 years old.

Re. fitting in time for the baby, we were planning on doing a much slower road trip than we’d have done up till now. i.e. 2/3 days minimum in each place so that if we are having a tough time, we can just have a pool/nap day and not worry too much about needing to clock up the miles.

Thanks for the above recommendations, we’re expecting baby imminently but I’m copying and pasting the contents of this thread to refer back to in a few months time once we start planning.

[Norsksaint]

We’re off to SA end of next week. Bagged 241 biz class seats with Ethiopian (*A) and looking forward to tryin them out. We’re travelling with our 9 month old and has a friend similarly warn us, to at least be careful. As others have said I think its mainly aimed at CPT and walking around after dark. We have decided to do lunches and do dinners at the places we have rented.

We decided against Safari, as others note its challenging with a baby and secondly the Maleria risk, so we have stuck to cape town and the surrounds.

At the same time a friend in Cape Town recommended these places so hopefully they are helpful to you as well as you begin planning!
We’re on to Philippines next year, just waiting for Turkish to release their reward seats and will book biz class return to Manilla….

Recommendations:

Restaurants / things to do in Cape Town:

• Trip up Table Mountain
• Hike up Lions Head
• V&A Waterfront including the Watershed as well as Oranjezicht Market
• Zeitz Mocca Museum of comtempopray Art
• Robben Island
• Kirstenbosch gardens
• Two Oceans Aqaurium
• A drive around the peninsular including Chapmans Peak, Cape Point, Muzeinberg, Fishhoek, Simons Town – Boulders Beach in Simons Town you can swim with the penguins
• Cape Town beaches: Camps Bay, Clifton, Llundudno, Muizenberg, Saunders Sea Point, Queens Beach Sea Point, Noordehoek

Cape Town Restaurants:

Breakfast / brunch / lunch:

• Oranjazicht Market next door the V&A Waterfront
• Kleinskys – very chilled
• Sonny & Irene
• Naked
• Jareds
• Norfolk Deli
• Lillys
• Garderners Cottage in Claremont area
• Melkbos – out in Blouberg area
• Norval Foundation out in Tokai
• Steenberg
• Hout bay for fish and chips
• Strandloper – this is a very rustic seafood braai up the coast of the western cape

Lunch / dinner:

• La Colombe – fancy but a treat!
• Kloof Street House
• Ariels
• Visi Social House
• Villa 47
• Between Us
• Manos
• Yu
• The Lawns
• Il Leone
• The Nines
• Zest
• NV80 – steak
• Stepbrothers – very chilled / small
• Cape Point Vineyards
• The Grand Beach V&A Waterfront

Things to do in Franschoek:

• Loads of wine farms to visit! And lots of picnics which are really lovely:
• There is also a tram in Franschoek that you can hop on and off to visit different wines farms
• The main town of Franschoek is small but really lovely, you can wander down the little main road in town to visit the shops and restaurants
• There is Saturday morning market there
• From Franschoek can also visit the wine farms in Stellenbosch and Paarl – might be nice to spend a day visiting the little town of Stellenbosch too – some lovely little boutiques etc as well

Notable wine farms – all will have restaurants and winetasting:

• Boschendal – they have a deli restaurant and more formal restaurant – can also have a picnic there under the trees which is really lovely. There are trails to ride a bike, walk and horseride as well. Wine tasting and a few other activities
• Babylonstoren – beautiful gardens to walk around – they have a more chilled restaurant called the glasshouse and more fancy one called babel. They have a really lovely spa there too.
• Webersberg – nice for picnics
• Vrede en Lust Winetasting and restaurant if you want something not fancy and a lot more chilled

Restaurants – defs book for Franschoek as these get full:

o La Petite Colombe
o La Petite Ferm
o Chefs Warehouse at Maison
o Protege
o Reubens
o Leopards Leap Family Vineyards
o Orangerie
o Bistro at Grande Provence
o La Motte Artisan Bakery
o Miko
o Haute Cabriere
o Epice
o Arkeste
o Cavalli

The above are smarter / more fancy but there are loads of more chilled options on the high street – all are nice!

Things to do in Hermanus:

• Saturday morning market
• Explore the Hemel & Aarde Valley
• Black coffee / the gallery for coffee and amazing croissants
• Art walk
• Hermanus Cliff path walk
• Fishermans Cottage – lovely little restaurant
• Swim in the tidal pool
• Voelklip Beach
• Perlemoen for a drink

[sp59]

I recall many years ago having a holiday to Orlando when our eldest was under 2. I spent most of the return flight standing at the back of the plane with him as he cried the whole way. Apart from that we all had a great time! He’ll be 34 tomorrow so it is a few years ago!

As regards SA, we had the most fabulous time there last year. Everyone told us we would likely be mugged or murdered so we should sort our wills out before we go! But we had no problems at all. We stayed in Camps Bay for 4 nights and very pleased with our choice. I should say though that although we never felt threatened, it is a bit disconcerting that all the properties are protected by high walls and notices proclaiming 24 hour armed response security! Within Cape Town we used Uber to get around.
After leaving Cape Town we drove to Franschoek for 2 nights. Franschoek is lovely, we walked out of the town to our restaurants each night and felt perfectly safe. We got cabs back just because it was late and there were no street lamps.

Overall without a doubt, the best holiday we have ever had. I think you would be fine self-driving to the wine areas and visiting Table Mountain in the daytime. I agree the waterfront might be a good place to stay in case of any night time emergencies.

Power cuts are extensive and inconvenient so make sure you stay in accommodation that has generators so lights and fridges stay on regardless.

My only hesitation is how much you will be able to enjoy all these things with a 10 month baby to care for. I guess baby will find fascinating the sights and sounds of the waterfront area and will love to see penguins but how much interest there will be in wine tasting, I am not sure! But as Northern Lass says, I likewise know plenty of people who have brought their children up to slot into their holiday choices and the kids it seems to me generally grow up to like the same things as their parents!

Good luck & congratulations, you are in for a very exciting year!

[zapato1060]

@sp59 Brilliant having those memories. Especially remembering them 34 years later! and @qc 40 years later! We went with our now 10 year (then 4) to SA. Hired a car in J’Burg using it to see the a large radius of area. We then returned it when we headed down to Durban via night sleeper train (service did not resume after covid 🙁 ). Brilliant experience. Then hired car again in Durban to see that area.

I would add that the car rental was invaluable and always there if son wanted a nap in back seat, or AC if he was hot or heating on if it was cold (as we found in Durban few days). I found it to be like a safe haven type of environment if that makes sense. If you stop by a eatery/experience, one half of the couple can get out if toddler or baby is sleeping in car to experience it separately.

Sometimes it felt like the holiday at times is to keep him/her happy rather than the enjoyment of you both but this is part and parcel of travels when very young. They dictate.

[squawk7700]

Norsksaint wrote:

We’re off to SA end of next week. Bagged 241 biz class seats with Ethiopian (*A) and looking forward to tryin them out. We’re travelling with our 9 month old and has a friend similarly warn us, to at least be careful. As others have said I think its mainly aimed at CPT and walking around after dark. We have decided to do lunches and do dinners at the places we have rented.

Thanks so much for this and for sharing the list of recommendations!

Given that you’re doing a similar trip with a very similarly aged infant I would be hugely grateful if you could log back on here in due course with a follow up!

I hope you have an amazing time.

[squawk7700]

Amy C and Mike G – any feedback on your recent trips?

[Mike G]

squawk7700 wrote:

Amy C and Mike G – any feedback on your recent trips?

We honestly had one of our best ever holidays, you really should stick with your original plan!

The flight times both ways were perfect so he slept pretty much the whole flight, with the added bonus of no jet lag. We stayed in Camps Bay and Franschhoek. We felt totally safe in Camps Bay. Had a few meals out at night and it felt fine walking back, although we didn’t stay out too late and were only a few streets back from the front. We had a hire care for the duration and that worked out great for his naps and gave us the freedom to explore. Didn’t have any issues with safety whilst driving and we drove all over. You need to be mindful that you’ll probably get beggars at traffic lights in certain areas, but if you just ignore them you’ll not have an issue. Apart from that it was absolutely fine and we didn’t feel nervous driving with the baby. The roads are great for driving, put our pot hole ridden roads to shame! The Chapman’s peak drive is just stunning. We didn’t drive at night but had no need to and I’m sure you’d be the same with a baby.

Franschhoek was a real highlight and you don’t need to have any concerns whatsoever about safety there. We managed to do the wine tram with him and it was brilliant. Only downside was that we had to limit our wine tasting! Such a stunning area though.

It was our first time in SA and we’re itching to go back already and explore more of it. It’s a beautiful country and such good value. We had a few disapproving comments from family/friends before we went about taking the baby, but we’re so glad we went ahead with it. Hope to hear in a few months that you had an equally fab holiday there!

[yonasl]

Biki wrote:

I went to Argentina at Christmas for 3 weeks and felt totally safe. We did a ferry to Uruguay for a few days, flew to Bariloche then Mendoza and enjoyed all of it.

I Also went to Mexico City and then flew down to Oaxaca for a few days last April. A lot of people said how dangerous CDMX is, but we walked around the whole time and didn’t feel unsafe once.

Agree with Mexico feeling perfectly safe (speaking the language helps). Of course some areas can be dangerous but you would rarely venture there.

I don’t know how much driving can be done in Argentina given the long distances and the fact you won’t only be travelling there but then will need to fly internally back and forth which can be a pain.

[philsUK]

We just got back from a holiday in South Africa, family trip with my wife, myself, 7 month old son and my inlaws. We stayed in Franscchoek and had a hire car to travel around. We did go into Capetown one day but spent most of the time in the Winelands. We were sensible and didn’t travel too far at night – otherwise driving around was completely fine.

We then flew to Johannesburg and onwards to a game reserve north of Johannesburg (Malaria free), this was absolutely amazing. We stayed in a camp that allowed our baby to come on drives with us. We didn’t feel unsafe at any point on the trip. Actually, our flight got delayed in Johannesburg and we drove to and from our hotel in Central Johannesburg from the airport (which I wouldn’t have done when we were there 5 years ago!).

I think with the baby it is easy to think of worst case scenarios.. I did. This is our first baby, but he slept both flights and loved the drives (sleeping!). Honestly, it was probably our best holiday.

Crime is high, but be sensible and reduce your risks.

[squawk7700]

Mike G, that’s brilliant, so glad you had a great time! A big confidence boost for myself and our own plans 🙂

My plan changes every day but as it stands we’ve reigned in the idea of ticking off Cape Town/winelands AND the garden route inside 12 days. Instead with baby we might take our foot off the gas a bit and stick to Cape Town/Fransccheok for half the duration and other half venture down towards Hermanus and De Hoop Nature Reserve. Perhaps stop at a reserve for a night if we want to see a giraffe and a zebra but ultimately use this trip as a taster and then perhaps plan a “proper” safari once baby is old enough to remember it.

philsUK wrote:

We just got back from a holiday in South Africa, family trip with my wife, myself, 7 month old son and my inlaws. We stayed in Franscchoek and had a hire car to travel around. We did go into Capetown one day but spent most of the time in the Winelands. We were sensible and didn’t travel too far at night – otherwise driving around was completely fine.

We then flew to Johannesburg and onwards to a game reserve north of Johannesburg (Malaria free), this was absolutely amazing. We stayed in a camp that allowed our baby to come on drives with us. We didn’t feel unsafe at any point on the trip. Actually, our flight got delayed in Johannesburg and we drove to and from our hotel in Central Johannesburg from the airport (which I wouldn’t have done when we were there 5 years ago!).

I think with the baby it is easy to think of worst case scenarios.. I did. This is our first baby, but he slept both flights and loved the drives (sleeping!). Honestly, it was probably our best holiday.

Crime is high, but be sensible and reduce your risks.

Thanks for this, really helpful! Do you mind sharing which reserve it was north of Joburg?

[Amy C]

Hiya, kept reminding myself to update you and then forgetting. As above, absolutely no concerns. Felt totally safe throughout. Had rampant food poisoning during the first week but didn’t stop us enjoying everything. If I could change anything I would have spend more time in Wilderness which was so stunning and wonderful one night wasn’t enough. Knysna was a bit ‘meh’ for me, was expecting more based on the things I’d heard. Mossel Bay…wish I’d not bothered. Franschhoek was gorgeous. Just wonderful. Especially as we were there on the weekend and therefore got to experience the fabulous market. Stayed at https://www.maisonmontagne.co.za with views to die for and so reasonably priced for a huge room that looked like it was decorated the day before.
Everyone we met was so friendly, the driving was super easy and the prices of everything fantastic compared to almost every other destination. I would not hesitate to return. I love SA. In fact the whole of Southern Africa is fabulous.

[squawk7700]

Thanks Amy, and sorry to hear of the food poisoning.

I’ve been searching everywhere for a reasonably priced vineyard with accommodation and was really struggling; Maison Montagne looks perfect!

Interesting re Kynsna, I kept coming back to it and then deciding it maybe wasn’t for us and so your impression backs that up. We might cut the Garden Route entirely and make it as far as De Hoop for a couple of nights before looping back to Cape Town. Quality over quantity!

For those that have done this trip (and similar) with infants – any travel cot recommendations?

[Norsksaint]

squawk7700 wrote:

Amy C and Mike G – any feedback on your recent trips?

Squawk…. apologies for the delay in coming back to you. Life with a young one is my excuse.

Anyway, I am pleased to say we had an incredible time and loved every moment down in SA. We would about to book again when we discovered we have another impending arrival for end of year. With two under 2 we’re going to play safe next year and do the canary islands with a view to going to SA in 2026.

Stick with your plans and go!
I have to say every restaurant, even those that were at the posher end of the scale were so well set up for kids. We tended to have lunches rather than dinners out, preferring to stay in, in the evenings and cook something if were hungry. All the restaurants had high-chairs didn’t complain when noise was made, made sure there plenty of shade etc.

From an itinerary pov we chose in the end 5 nights in Hout Bay, 4 in Franschhoek, 3 Hermannus and then finally 5 nights on the outskirts of Constantia.

Our daughter flew really well and again Ethiopian were great.

Happy to provide any more details if you need it, but +1 from us to say stick with your plans and enjoy.